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RE: DSL Modem/Router wanted
by Brian Densmore 25 Jan '05

25 Jan '05

> -----Original Message----- > From: Brian Kelsay > > ... The inclusion of the phone call cost is that if he has to > call her and walk her thru some long procedure or fix, it can > get expensive quick. He probably wants a drop in solution. I got that point. The part I don't get is how the $0.05/min keeps out competitors. It is quite easy to "rent" an 800 number to use to get quite cheap communications with people in foreign countries. He could rent the 800 number and she could call it for free. However $0.05/min ($3/hr) isn't all that expensive, and perhaps that was what he meant about keeping out the competition. Sorry ,I can't provide a link to the rent-a-800-number services. If I recall correctly, I could call Russia/Ukraine for $0.029/per minute back when I was using it. A quick google didn't turn it up. It might require some google hacking to find it again. Brian Densmore

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RE: DSL Modem/Router wanted
by Brian Kelsay 25 Jan '05

25 Jan '05

He said it was a laptop. It would have to be a USB PCMCIA card. The inclusion of the phone call cost is that if he has to call her and walk her thru some long procedure or fix, it can get expensive quick. He probably wants a drop in solution. He should know from his own time over there whether or not their phone lines are wired the same. We use 2-wire into a RJ-11 here, do they use some funky plug requiring an adapter? Is their ethernet wired to a different standard and if so, will it still work w/ US equip.? IEEE is supposed to be an international standards body, but they still use different electrical voltages than us, so anything is possible. Brian Kelsay >>> "Brian Densmore" <> 01/25/05 10:18AM >>> Why not just install a USB card in an open slot in the existing PC? > > her thing. What she has is an older, pre-USB IBM laptop with > Windows98 and > Mandrake 9.x on it, and a working ethernet card. An older IBM laptop with no USB? Wow, that's old! I have an older IBM laptop (originally with Windows 98) and it has USB. > > Local phone calls in the U.K., including calls to a dial-up > ISP, are usually > charged at 5¢/minute - one of the ways British Telecom tries > to clamp down on > the competition. Lost me on that one. Guess you need to have the context.

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Re: DSL Modem/Router wanted
by Brian Kelsay 25 Jan '05

25 Jan '05

I didn't realize you were not going over there with it. But, as with anything, where there is a will, there is a way. If you knew she could get a basic PC that had USB on it over there, you could build IPCop on a HDD here and just send her the HDD and NICs from the PC you built it on. Label each NIC as to what it connects to (e.g. Red NIC, internet, Green NIC, local Network). If she is capable of following some basic directions and using a screwdriver, it is doable. Another alternative might be, looking to see if there is a Linksys device that can connect to a USB DSL modem. Just a thought. Ethernet based DSL modems can be had for less than $50 on ebay I think. You could even buy from a person in England and have it shipped directly to her. Just trying to give a complete picture of your options. Brian Kelsay >>> Jonathan Hutchins <> 01/25/05 10:04AM >>> On Tuesday 25 January 2005 07:33 am, Brian Kelsay wrote: > What is the brand of the modem? It may be supported by the IPCop firewall > distro. IPCop is used in the US and in Europe and they have some fixes > added for specific modems. You would just have to use an old PC that has > USB on it. Trying to remotely build a new PC with firewall just to support a stupid USB modem isn't a good idea. What I need is something that will connect to the existing, working Ethernet card. We had some new clothing that was a Christmas gift shipped there, and the import duties were about 30%. The town we're in is _very_ rural. Think middle o' Kansas. More cows than computers. I have a couple of PII 400's there that could be built into firewalls, but no monitors for them - I was going to use an ATI All-in-Wonder and a TV, but I found out that it's not easy to get the TV-Out working, let alone make it the primary video. My wife is a Microbiologist. She's no dummy, but building computers is not her thing. What she has is an older, pre-USB IBM laptop with Windows98 and Mandrake 9.x on it, and a working ethernet card. Local phone calls in the U.K., including calls to a dial-up ISP, are usually charged at 5¢/minute - one of the ways British Telecom tries to clamp down on the competition. _______________________________________________ Kclug mailing list Kclug(a)kclug.org http://kclug.org/mailman/listinfo/kclug

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RE: DSL Modem/Router wanted
by Brian Densmore 25 Jan '05

25 Jan '05

> -----Original Message----- > From: Jonathan Hutchins > > On Tuesday 25 January 2005 07:33 am, Brian Kelsay wrote: > > > Trying to remotely build a new PC with firewall just to > support a stupid USB > modem isn't a good idea. What I need is something that will > connect to the > existing, working Ethernet card. Why not just install a usb card in an open slot in the existing PC? > ... The town we're in is _very_ > rural. Think > middle o' Kansas. More cows than computers. They still have cows in England? Are they still mad? ;') > > her thing. What she has is an older, pre-USB IBM laptop with > Windows98 and > Mandrake 9.x on it, and a working ethernet card. An older IBM laptop with no USB? Wow, that's old! I have an older IBM laptop (originally with Windows 98) and it has USB. > > Local phone calls in the U.K., including calls to a dial-up > ISP, are usually > charged at 5¢/minute - one of the ways British Telecom tries > to clamp down on > the competition. Lost me on that one. Guees you need to have the context.

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Re: DSL Modem/Router wanted
by Brian Kelsay 25 Jan '05

25 Jan '05

What is the brand of the modem? It may be supported by the IPCop firewall distro. IPCop is used in the US and in Europe and they have some fixes added for specific modems. You would just have to use an old PC that has USB on it. Brian Kelsay >>> Jonathan Hutchins <> 01/25/05 07:28AM In case you were wondering: Yes, I would be getting RoadRunner if I could, but they don't have service in Andover, England. I'm not even sure a U.S. spec DSL modem will work in the U.K., but it's worth a shot. My wife got DSL from British Telecom, who's customer service policy is "we don't care, we don't have to, we're not only the phone company we're the government". They gave her a USB modem, and the older IBM laptop she has won't support it under either Windows98 or Mandrake 9.x.

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Conservatives (was: Open Source Values [off-topic])
by Garrett Goebel 25 Jan '05

25 Jan '05

csappenfield at kc dot rr dot com wrote: > > While it might be comforting (especially after the trouncing > in the recent elections) to think of conservatives in general > as jackbooted nitwits who love "hierarchy and authority", it > probably just isn't true. For example, conservatives worship > free markets, which are nothing if not "anarchy, lawlessness, > [and] chaos". > > Conservatives also like property rights. Free software comes > with enormous property rights, in exchange for which we give > up some methods to profit from those rights. Free software > allows cooperation, but doesn't force it- installing Linux on > your computer doesn't make you a member of some commune, > regardless of what Forbes would have you believe. > > Business conservatism, rather than political conservatism, is > what really opposes Free software. Let's set the record straight. Here are the core canon's of the ideological ax grinding conservative, from the man (Russell Kirk) who coined the term in the first place: http://www.kirkcenter.org/kirk/thought.html > > Ten Conservative Principles (1993) > > First, the conservative believes that there exists an enduring > moral order. > > Second, the conservative adheres to custom, convention, and > continuity. > > Third, conservatives believe in what may be called the principle > of prescription. > > Fourth, conservatives are guided by their principle of prudence. > > Fifth, conservatives pay attention to the principle of variety. > > Sixth, conservatives are chastened by their principle of > imperfectability. > > Seventh, conservatives are persuaded that freedom and property > are closely linked. > > Eighth, conservatives uphold voluntary community, quite as they > oppose involuntary collectivism. > > Ninth, the conservative perceives the need for prudent restraints > upon power and upon human passions. > > Tenth, the thinking conservative understands that permanence and > change must be recognized and reconciled in a vigorous society. -- Garrett Goebel IS Development Specialist ScriptPro Direct: 913.403.5261 5828 Reeds Road Main: 913.384.1008 Mission, KS 66202 Fax: 913.384.2180 www.scriptpro.com garrett at scriptpro dot com

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RE: Open Source Values
by Garrett Goebel 25 Jan '05

25 Jan '05

I'm uncomfortable lumping the smorgasbord of people, projects, and licenses together and slapping the OSS label on them. And as everyone has a different one, I'm unsure of the merit of discussing value systems. That said, OSS from the legal perspective seems to be about legal frameworks competing to preserve the equivalent of free-range intellectual property. A Commons of the mind that is shored up by a functioning system of community standards and social practices. Where the only coercion is the coercion to share and share alike. All of that provides an incredible opportunity to anyone with a mind and the desire to use it to: o create o scratch an itch o learn from others o avoid ideological ax grinding o avoid reinventing the wheel IMHO, the best projects are the ones that foster a self-supporting community that is welcoming and friendly, but moreover is a meritocracy focused on actually doing the task at hand. Smart people clump together. When a bunch of smart and productive people clump together under an OSS license amazing things can happen. There is a feeling of awe that I get, when following the creative efforts of extremely capable people. It makes you feel like a child. I can hear myself saying: I want to do that. I want to be that good at something. I want to make a difference. -- Garrett Goebel IS Development Specialist ScriptPro Direct: 913.403.5261 5828 Reeds Road Main: 913.384.1008 Mission, KS 66202 Fax: 913.384.2180 www.scriptpro.com garrett at scriptpro dot com

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RE: Dell
by Brian Densmore 25 Jan '05

25 Jan '05

> -----Original Message----- > From: Dave Hull > > Quoting Brian Densmore: > > > Compaq servers can also be purchased with Linux on them right? > > ... During the era when I > was working with > Compaq hardware, everything was proprietary. If a drive > failed or a stick of > RAM failed, they had to be replaced with Compaq parts. And > those parts failed > on a regular basis. > > ... when Compaq and > HP merged... Maybe part of the reason Compaq merged with HP was, failure rates and proprietary parts. We just got in a Compaq server for a client last week and it looked like a pretty decent server. > > I've been working on Dell hardware at work, exclusively for > the last six years So then you have no recent experience with Compaq servers then. Six years is an eternity in this market. > and have been extremely pleased with it. I was running Linux > on hardware from > Dell before they supported it with very little problems. No one ever said Dell didn't work with Linux, but just that they are not really supportive of Linux. In fact I hear lots of complaints about their Customer support. But what it boils down to is there are plenty of stories going both ways. Dell has always had a pretty decent reputation for rock-solid hardware. Compaqs have always had a rep for proprietary. HP has always been known as rock-solid and expensive. IBM is well IBM. Then there is everyone else. I don't have much experience personally with any brands as I tend to build whatever I need, because the hardware is always rock solid, the price is competitive and the service is outstanding. So I get the best of all worlds. If something fails I always know who to blame, and where to go to get it fixed. [Let the hardware religion war continue] Brian D

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RE: Open Source Values
by Brian Densmore 25 Jan '05

25 Jan '05

> -----Original Message----- > From: csappenfield > > While it might be comforting (especially after the trouncing > in the recent elections) to think of conservatives in general > as ... The problem here isn't what political conservatives are or what <fill in political ideology group> are. The problem is that when you make generalizations there are always large numbers of people that do not fit the profile. This is the problem that Ralph Nader (this guy really annoys me) and some other people are trying to fix. When you have only two credible choices it is necessary to sacrifice perhaps a great deal of one's values to get the one with the most similar values elected. As far as the last election being a trouncing. It was not much of a trouncing, in fact it's been one of the closer elections in history. [large rant on politics and number manipulation deleted] He won by less than 51% of the vote IIRC. Hardly a trouncing.

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Re: Open Source Values
by csappenfield＠kc.rr.com 25 Jan '05

25 Jan '05

While it might be comforting (especially after the trouncing in the recent elections) to think of conservatives in general as jackbooted nitwits who love "hierarchy and authority", it probably just isn't true. For example, conservatives worship free markets, which are nothing if not "anarchy, lawlessness, [and] chaos". Conservatives also like property rights. Free software comes with enormous property rights, in exchange for which we give up some methods to profit from those rights. Free software allows cooperation, but doesn't force it- installing Linux on your computer doesn't make you a member of some commune, regardless of what Forbes would have you believe. Business conservatism, rather than political conservatism, is what really opposes Free software. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Herrmann <kclug(a)itdepends.com> Date: Tuesday, January 25, 2005 0:03 am Subject: Re: Open Source Values > I agree with the statement below, and is why I have a hard time > understanding the appeal to the conservative person, which > typically > believes in hierarchy and authority. I really want to hear from > Hal and > Bill on what about OSS that appeals to their values. I'm > listening. > Trying to understand. Help me out here guys. > > Thanks for the input Monty, > Jim > > Monty J. Harder wrote: > > >To the conventional, authoritarian mind, this is 'anarchy, > lawlessness,>chaos!' They can't conceive of a society without > government experts > >giving the imperial imprimatur to certain endeavours; they are > >frightened by the notion that people who aren't even licensed to > >practice computing could build systems to do mission-critical work. > > > -- > Progressive Values ARE American Values > Responsibility, Empathy, Freedom, Opportunity, Prosperity, Fairness, > Trust, Honesty, Open Communication, Community, Cooperation > http://musicalprogress.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > Kclug mailing list > Kclug(a)kclug.org > http://kclug.org/mailman/listinfo/kclug >

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