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3239 discussions

FPGA
by Jared 13 Aug '07

13 Aug '07

Wow. I'm excited! The emerging idea of putting tiny processors onto the memory chips, and thus creating a micronetwork of decentralized microprocessors which can be delegated to specialized memory microtasks IS TERNARY in structure. I have been waiting for this for a long time. I believe it heralds the beginning of Pattern-based computing systems, which will eventually mature into full ternary hardware and software, and carries a whole new way to interact with the computer, as a learning, teaching, and data processing device. First things first: Since we're still on the subject of Field Programmable Gate Arrays, here is a computer-tinkerists project to consider: 1. All standard ternary logic gates can be emulated by arranging a subset of binary gates. Therefore, an entirely ternary design is possible TODAY using an ordinary off-the-shelf FPGA. 2. Among other things, a ternary chip processes Analog-to-Digital data more efficiently than a binary chip. It becomes significantly more efficient with each "trit." To start: a lot of toys use 1 bit D/A converters for sound. A one bit trinary converter has almost twice the quality of a binary system. Here is more on this idea: http://www.trinary.cc/Tutorial/Interface/Analog.htm 3. All modern programming languages are essentially binary in structure, heavily relying on binary branching and counting loops such as IF and FOR. Programmers are therefore increasingly thinking in binary thought patterns, as an incremental social phenomenon. This has long-term consequences on the way we perceive our own future, as a culture, because programmers are designing the computer systems which increasingly shape our interactions with each other. 4. Electricity is itself ternary: A wire conducts in one direction, or the other, or not at all. This is a ternary switch in its most simple form. A native ternary chip is more efficient than binary because all three states of electrical flow are used, instead of only ON/OFF. It is silly to use binary-only algorithms on a ternary chip, just as it is difficult to build a ternary chip out of binary pieces. Both are possible, but waste effort. 5. Artificial intelligence algorithms and some sophisticated search algorithms often exploit this efficient ternary design, but none are doing it at the hardware level, AFAIK. 6. Some of the first computers built (in the 1950s and 1960s) were ternary computers, and worked very well. When silicon overtook the mechanical switches, designers opted for binary, and we've been stuck with it ever since. 7. Ternary processing is more like the way your own brain processes information. That is why AI keeps exploring ternary algorithms. And I believe THIS is the most important reason to experiment with this project. Now for the project: Build a ternary CPU on a FPGA, and use the inherent affinity for analog processing to perform some advanced experiments in generating truly random numbers. I believe it is possible to generate a continual stream of purely random numbers with a ternary design. There are some good uses for such a stream, including truly secure encryption. The question: WHY NOT DO THIS IN BINARY? Well, you _can_ but you need to generate entropy with an analog interface (like moving your mouse around, etc). So I respond: why not do it in ternary? Here is a second justification: Donald Knuth in The Art of Computer Programming, writes "Balanced ternary notation is the most beautiful of all." Some calculations which are quite difficult in binary (&tc), requiring several steps of data movement, are incredibly elegant in ternary, sometimes requiring a simple inversion of the "trits." There is a third justification which goes like this: Because of the latent necessity of designing algorithms which MUST branch TRUE or FALSE because this is simply extending the physical capability of the underlying chip, all programmers naturally think and consider their options from within a binary thinking process. This is an artificial and inefficient extension of our natural ternary mind (which, being electrical, utilizes all three states of the switch described earlier). I personally want to demonstrate that a significant number of difficult processing challenges are more easily managed by a programmer who "thinks" in the native mode of electrical flow, instead of thinking in a limited subset of that same flow. I also want to demonstrate that a PATTERN-based access to data is a thousandfold more efficient than the TREE-based access which all binary systems utilize today. Tree-based access is necessary because binary systems cannot "leap" into undefined space. Everything must be carefully linked to what has gone before, in the shape of a tree. Pattern-based access can utilize the same switches for multiple layers of information, and can thus "leap" into undefined space without corrupting what is already there. This idea is nearly inconceivable from within binary thought processes, because it appears to be a form of DIVIDE-BY-ZEROing data into place (What, you mean you want the data to be in a continual state of crashing my computer?). In fact, it is much more efficient, because layers and layers of data can be built up with the same switches, as long as the switches can be triggered by a time-based pattern event which originates with a particular "seed" shape. Thus the "tree" still exists, but moves into a third dimension, not just laterally like ordinary binary databases and filesystems. This is the actual reason I want to work on this project. I think that a whole new way of thinking about computers and the structure of our own mind is buried in the fact that some of the first computers ever designed were ternary in structure. Now, if that did not convince you, here is one of the most interesting things you have ever seen, in the way of computers. It is one of the oldest mechanical computers ever built, and, it was ternary.

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Re: How About a 710Ghz CPU in the near future
by Jared 13 Aug '07

13 Aug '07

> Well, it looks like they may have found a way to get > over the wall. Check out this article > (http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/feb06/2800) and see what the latest > transistor technology is. This article goes into some really heavy > technical descriptions of what is being worked on. Very interesting. Clearly we are looking at something entirely new in the way of switching transistors. Hmmm. We're now feasibly approaching the terahertz processor milestone. I am glad you sent the link. The detailed technical description was some of the best I've ever seen on the subject. -Jared

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How About a 710Ghz CPU in the near future
by Phil Thayer 10 Aug '07

10 Aug '07

For many years the semiconductor industry has been looking at ways to make the transistor smaller and faster. As chip dies got down below 10 microns and transistors are working at the atomic level they have hit a wall that nature has in place that they have been trying to get over. Well, it looks like they may have found a way to get over the wall. Check out this article (http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/feb06/2800) and see what the latest transistor technology is. This article goes into some really heavy technical descriptions of what is being worked on. Very interesting. Enjoy. Phil

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Laptop repair
by Tim reid 10 Aug '07

10 Aug '07

For all you laptop enthusiasts out there: I have a Dell Inspiron 9300 with the back light gone out. I have been quoted $350 for parts and $50 for labor. Would you guys think that this is a fair estimate? TIA Tim

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What's in a node?- RE: talking about where processor or memory goes and why.
by Oren Beck 08 Aug '07

08 Aug '07

I have experience points of sorts in both hardware and software. That and a certain degree of having seen what worked or did not has been instructional. All of that to explain my creds for why I am directing this in a path someone may profit from. We can now order in SMD form components that were science fiction tech dreams- and thought to forever remain so. Sparkfun for example has some projects worth looking at to get into "what's under the hardware hood" so to speak. Once you get competent with SMD tech and board design it becomes possible to baby step for real some of the concepts in the "where does cpu/memory go?" As in - someone proposed early X80? or suchlike cpu on a memory device. Well- why not have some ubergeeken amongst us whack together some prototypes? Sadly my skills are a bit rusty compared to others on list- but then again, if I get bored this winter? The whole point is- We are good at arguments but have been a bit slack on incarnating much. I would love to see KCLUG as a group produce something of dramatic impact, but will settle for some hack that does something at all. Oren

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Xming X Server for Windows
by Billy Crook 08 Aug '07

08 Aug '07

A while back the topic came up either in the IRC or on the list about wanting to run an X11 app on a Linux server, and view it on a windows machine. Someone suggested Cygwin, but I just came ac across something else that might do the trick. From their site: Xming X Server for Windows<http://www.straightrunning.com/XmingNotes/#sect-1>Xming is the leading free unlimited X Window server for Microsoft Windows (XP/2003/Vista). Xming is fully featured, small and fast, simple to install<http://www.straightrunning.com/XmingNotes/#head-13>and because it is standalone native Microsoft Windows, easily transported [image: [WWW]]portable <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_portable_applications>as a *Pocket PC X server*. It is totally secure when used with [image: [WWW]]SSH<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ssh>and optionally includes a special PuTTY SSH client <http://www.straightrunning.com/XmingNotes/#head-145> and a portable PuTTY replacement<http://www.straightrunning.com/XmingNotes/portableputty.php>. Xming is built <http://www.straightrunning.com/XmingNotes/building.php> for Microsoft Windows (32-bit x86) from [image: [WWW]]X.Org<http://xorg.freedesktop.org/wiki>source code kept current and secure with updates for [image: [WWW]]X11R7.3 <http://gitweb.freedesktop.org/?o=age>, [image: [WWW]]XKB<http://freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/XKeyboardConfig>, [image: [WWW]]FreeType2 <http://freetype.sourceforge.net/index2.html> and [image: [WWW]]Freedesktop Bugzilla <https://bugs.freedesktop.org/>. My patches<http://www.straightrunning.com/Xming/>are applied and the code cross-compiled with [image: [WWW]]MinGW <http://www.mingw.org/> and [image: [WWW]]Pthreads-Win32<http://sourceware.org/pthreads-win32/> . Ongoing Xming development is essential because its predecessor projects, [image: [WWW]]Freedesktop Xming <http://freedesktop.org/wiki/Xming> and [image: [WWW]]Cygwin/X <http://x.cygwin.com/>, have lapsed. Xming is mostly a derivative work and has many licenses e.g. the zlib license, LGPLv2 for Pthreads, MIT/X11 for all PuTTY tools and the pixman library. The Xming server is licensed GNU GPLv2<http://www.straightrunning.com/Xming/COPYING>, but repackaging and/or redistributing any part (or whole) of the Xming website, documentation, images, executables or installers, by the internet, other projects/products or via media such as CD's, without asking permission, clearly acknowledging the contribution of 'Colin Harrison' and providing links to [image: [WWW]]StraightRunning.com/XmingNotes/<http://www.straightrunning.com/XmingNotes/>and [image: [WWW]]SourceForge Project Xming <http://sourceforge.net/projects/xming> will be regarded as a breach of copyright.

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17" CRT Monitor free to good home
by Arthur Pemberton 08 Aug '07

08 Aug '07

I have the following monitor available for free to any one willing to come pick it up, I live a few blocks away from UMKC. Monitor: Dell UltraScan P780 - http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/monitors/p780/En/Index.htm Last time I used it, it worked quite well (had it on a test machine). If you'd like it, email me off list please. Arthur Pembertpn -- Fedora Core 6 and proud

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Linux jobs?
by Shawn C. Powell 07 Aug '07

07 Aug '07

Hello Everyone, Do any of you know of any job openings working with Linux in network or systems administration or maintenance? At any level? I very much like working with Linux and open source and would like to stay with that if possible :). In brief, I have for the past four years among other duties administered network and systems for an agricultural equipment retailer that has two locations connected by a T1. The primary accounting system was PFW running on a model 270 AS/400. The desktops ran XP. I deployed Gentoo Linux machines for our internal web server, mail host, database server, and external firewall/router. I have installed and maintained the following: Gentoo Linux hardened Postfix / Courier / Spamassassin Apache 2 Tomcat Apache Cocoon Apache Lenya Samba 3 Squirrel Mail NTP Thanks for your time. Sincerely, Shawn C. Powell

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rabid futurist on the loose! ( I jest)
by David Nicol 07 Aug '07

07 Aug '07

The following is copied and pasted from the comments on http://www.informationweek.com/windows/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=201202009 Peter Kogge was forced out of IBM for demonstrating that memory chips can make use of the thousands of bits that are actually read in every memory cycle if processors are built into the memory chips. Even if only 8088 type processors were built into a chip that also had the full adressable 1 megabyte of memory and operated at current processor cycle speads, the computing, and gaming capacity of the billions (Carl Sagan) of transistors in modern PCs would be beyond the imagination of the most avid gamers. The hundreds of processors that could be built on a single chip could be connected by data paths that resemble the operations of data paths of nerve cells in the brain. Every nerve cell in the brain has hundreds if not thousands of connections to other cells and a few giga-bytes of data storage. USB might not be a bad starting design, after all, with user programmable processors and RAM with the 4 gigs of eprom. There could even be an 8088 section of the thumb processor that could run DOS 3.1 and WordPerfect 4.7(After all, WordPerfect was used with most of the DOS 3.1 units.) right on the "ThumbDrive". Vista could connect the screen and keyboard in a few seconds to the virtual screen and keyboard in the RAM of the THUMB computer. A much simpler program running under Caldera Dos could do the same in a few milliseconds. Such a system would do almost all of the word processing that is now done on super-pentiums with 4 gigs of ram. -- Prioritize based on common sense? Is that some kind of joke?

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Dell PowerEdge 6450 Quad Xeon 900Mhz, 2GB RAM, 2x 9GB SCSI Drives for sale
by Joe Brouhard 07 Aug '07

07 Aug '07

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=330153719496&ssPage… Available on ebay only. the reserve price is $225, but i'm willing to pull it off Ebay for $350 without shipping (can bring it down to KC for pickup..) -- Joe Brouhard jbrouhard(a)gmail.com

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